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Late ballot papers and 'interference' investigated
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| Making a mark: a voter enters a polling station but not all found the democratic process as straightforward as usual |
Controversy beset the elections across Barnet leading to allegations of foul play last week.
Ballot papers arrived late and election officials gave inappropriate advice to voters, according to some residents taking part in the London-wide elections.
One voter claimed up to 12 people were directed into a room where they received an explanation of the process of tactical voting.
The allegation of interference, which has been referred to the police by Barnet Council, could be treated as a criminal offence if found to be true.
Jacqui Hobson, a resident of the borough, claims a presiding officer gave a ten-minute talk about how to use the forms and direct votes.
She said: "Usually polling stations are quiet, and the only thing you are asked is your name and address, but a lot of people looked shocked we were being spoken to like we were five-years-old.
"We live in a democratic society, and it didn't seem like that. I didn't think people were allowed to influence in that way. The votes from there should be considered null and void."
A council spokesman said: "A complaint has been received by our electoral services team relating to the conduct of a presiding officer on May 1.
"As this is potentially a criminal matter, we are unable to comment further prior to any potential police investigation."
Barnet police confirmed the allegation had been reported but were unable to say what action had been taken.
In Friern Barnet, some residents said they were unable to vote between 7pm and 8pm because of a lack of ballot papers at the polling station in Goldsmith Road.
Bob Pearson, who was conducting an exit poll, said voters reported papers running out on one side of the polling station. He said voters were told the remaining papers could not be divided out because they were already registered to an address.
He added: "I spoke to various people going in and they were furious to lose their democratic right.
"If people from one area were unable to vote, they shouldn't have let the other side of the road continue voting."
Conservative ward councillor for Coppetts, Kate Salinger, said: "I find it unbelievable that in 2008 the required number of ballot papers were not at the polling station.
"We were trying to get people
out to vote and, when we heard
they were not able to, we couldn't believe it."
A council spokesman admitted the station was down to 100 papers, but said they had not received any complaints from people unable to vote.
He added: "The returning officer became aware there weren't enough ballots delivered and ordered more, but at no point did they run out."
Residents in Mill Hill had been made to wait earlier in the day after ballot papers failed to turn up to some polling stations on time.
Five polling stations were without the required papers for up to 20 minutes after the elections began at 7am.
A council spokesman said there was a problem on Wednesday night with the automated system for allocating the borough's 175,000 ballot papers.
The allocation had missed 20 polling stations, meaning the process had to be carried out manually by the electoral registration team.
The spokesman said the team worked tirelessly throughout the night to ensure all 160 polling stations opened on time, but added: "Unfortunately, a handful of polling stations did not receive their ballot papers until some minutes after 7am and we sincerely apologise to those voters affected."
The five polling stations affected were Mill Hill East Station, Dollis Infants School, Barnet Impact, St Paul's Church Hall and Courtland JMI School, which was last to have its papers delivered at 7.21am.
9:10am Thursday 8th May 2008
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CommentPosted by: Daniel Hope, Barnet on 5:40pm Thu 8 May 08
Hallelujah. A Councillor speaks! But why are the other £1,000,000 Councillors too cowardly to speak up in public when things go wrong? Why is the Chief Executive not speaking publicly and openly on this? This Council is becoming increasingly remote and machine like.
Hallelujah. A Councillor speaks! But why are the other £1,000,000 Councillors too cowardly to speak up in public when things go wrong? Why is the Chief Executive not speaking publicly and openly on this? This Council is becoming increasingly remote and machine like.
Posted by: Fed Up, LBB on 8:03pm Thu 8 May 08
I was bewidered when looking at my polling card this time around. There was a polling station situated across the road from my home, however my designated one was about three quarters of a mile up the road. My inclination to wander up there in the rain after returning home from work was fairly limited. Could this have been intentional?
I was bewidered when looking at my polling card this time around. There was a polling station situated across the road from my home, however my designated one was about three quarters of a mile up the road. My inclination to wander up there in the rain after returning home from work was fairly limited. Could this have been intentional?
Posted by: Hannah, Barnet on 8:52pm Thu 8 May 08
Is this Councillor, sorry former Councillor Hope being bitter again? The question to be asked is did this have a material effect on the result of the election? My guess is no, and if the council has had no complaints people can't be that upset. Time to accept that sometimes people do the best in a bad situation. As for the guy giving advice, could it be that it is just sour grapes from one of the losers in the vote?
Is this Councillor, sorry former Councillor Hope being bitter again? The question to be asked is did this have a material effect on the result of the election? My guess is no, and if the council has had no complaints people can't be that upset. Time to accept that sometimes people do the best in a bad situation. As for the guy giving advice, could it be that it is just sour grapes from one of the losers in the vote?
Posted by: Fed Up, LBB on 9:05pm Thu 8 May 08
Hannah, if by 'the guy giving advice' you're referring to myself, there are no sour grapes involved whatsoever. I didn't vote, as I'm not in the habit of banging my head against a wall. I'm looking forward to moving out of this area sometime soon and leaving it to the self-satisfied people that deserve it. I can't compete with you, and really don't have any wish to, keep keeping up with the Jones'es, you know it makes sense.
Hannah, if by 'the guy giving advice' you're referring to myself, there are no sour grapes involved whatsoever. I didn't vote, as I'm not in the habit of banging my head against a wall. I'm looking forward to moving out of this area sometime soon and leaving it to the self-satisfied people that deserve it. I can't compete with you, and really don't have any wish to, keep keeping up with the Jones'es, you know it makes sense.
Posted by: Don't Call Me Dave, People's Republic of Barnet on 9:12pm Thu 8 May 08
Hannah
What is “a material affect”? If even just one voter has been denied the opportunity to cast his/her vote due to the incompetence of the council, then the Returning Officer must walk the plank.
Hannah
What is “a material affect”? If even just one voter has been denied the opportunity to cast his/her vote due to the incompetence of the council, then the Returning Officer must walk the plank.
Posted by: Reality, Bites on 10:17pm Thu 8 May 08
Good to see Daniel being bitter again !
So the Ballot papers were twenty minutes late, Well Bo Ho: it's not ideal, it's not good, it should have been handled better; now get over it. If Leo Boland can't do better next time, then sack the useless g**.
If just one voter has been denied his right to vote, well that's life get over it.
Good to see Daniel being bitter again !
So the Ballot papers were twenty minutes late, Well Bo Ho: it's not ideal, it's not good, it should have been handled better; now get over it. If Leo Boland can't do better next time, then sack the useless g**.
If just one voter has been denied his right to vote, well that's life get over it.
Posted by: Rog T, Mill Hill on 8:12pm Fri 9 May 08
Having read "Reality Bites" comment here, I suddenly realise that Daniel Hope is not as bad as I thought. He makes a good point above. I am starting to think he is actually the sensible wing of the Barnet Tories.
Mill Hill is a predominantly commuter ward. Anyone wishing to be in work for 9am in the City will probably get the 7.36, 7.47 or 8.06 train from Mill Hill. I'd estimate at least 50-100 people board each of these trains. As many commuters cast their vote before work and many of these would have seen the chaos and left without voting. How many didn't vote? How many were inconvenienced? Barnet Council had 4 years to prepare and they could get it organised. Maybe "Reality Bites" doesn't value his vote but what right has he to dismiss other peoples democratic right. A bit of advice to you Reality - if you can't say anything vaguely intelligent be quiet. You are only making yourself look silly.
Having read "Reality Bites" comment here, I suddenly realise that Daniel Hope is not as bad as I thought. He makes a good point above. I am starting to think he is actually the sensible wing of the Barnet Tories.
Mill Hill is a predominantly commuter ward. Anyone wishing to be in work for 9am in the City will probably get the 7.36, 7.47 or 8.06 train from Mill Hill. I'd estimate at least 50-100 people board each of these trains. As many commuters cast their vote before work and many of these would have seen the chaos and left without voting. How many didn't vote? How many were inconvenienced? Barnet Council had 4 years to prepare and they could get it organised. Maybe "Reality Bites" doesn't value his vote but what right has he to dismiss other peoples democratic right. A bit of advice to you Reality - if you can't say anything vaguely intelligent be quiet. You are only making yourself look silly.
Posted by: Reality, Bites on 9:10pm Fri 9 May 08
What happened in Mill Hill was regrettable, and certainly not desirable, but it was a human failing. We hope that the returning officer learns from his mistakes and demonstrates his gained knowledge by handling the next election in a better manor; otherwise he should be removed from the job.
What Rog T demonstrates here in his comments are also human traits.
When faced with opinions to which he does not agree, he attacks the person not the argument: that is a human quality usually demonstrated by immature humans.
When faced with human failings he does not give an allowance for the fact that in 95% of the Borough of Barnet there was no failure of the poll nor does he speak of Camden which was administered by the same returning officer which had no problems: by ignoring the relative scale of the problem he fails to demonstrate a sense of proportion, this also is an attribute of the immature.
We can only hope that Rog T will learn to demonstrate a sense of proportion and gain maturity whilst refraining from indulging in personal insults.
Until that time, Rog T will continue to degrade the value of his expressed opinions.
But I somehow doubt he will be able to see it quite that way.
What happened in Mill Hill was regrettable, and certainly not desirable, but it was a human failing. We hope that the returning officer learns from his mistakes and demonstrates his gained knowledge by handling the next election in a better manor; otherwise he should be removed from the job.
What Rog T demonstrates here in his comments are also human traits.
When faced with opinions to which he does not agree, he attacks the person not the argument: that is a human quality usually demonstrated by immature humans.
When faced with human failings he does not give an allowance for the fact that in 95% of the Borough of Barnet there was no failure of the poll nor does he speak of Camden which was administered by the same returning officer which had no problems: by ignoring the relative scale of the problem he fails to demonstrate a sense of proportion, this also is an attribute of the immature.
We can only hope that Rog T will learn to demonstrate a sense of proportion and gain maturity whilst refraining from indulging in personal insults.
Until that time, Rog T will continue to degrade the value of his expressed opinions.
But I somehow doubt he will be able to see it quite that way.
Posted by: PR, Ruels on 9:36am Sat 10 May 08
If one person was deined their vote the the Returning Officer should be put in prision.
If one person was deined their vote the the Returning Officer should be put in prision.
Posted by: John, Finchley on 10:26am Sat 10 May 08
I think we have seen this article somewhere else:
A woman was found dead after two Tube maintenance workers wrestled a man to the ground in the car park of Finchley Central Underground station. The workers thought that the man was drunk and about to drive away but on arrival the police found a blood-stained knife and blood on his clothing. After questioning the man, police forced entry to a house and the body of a woman in her fifties was found.
The Metropolitan Police said that the London Ambulance Service pronounced the woman dead at about 3.10am yesterday. She has not yet been formally identified.The man, who is in his twenties, was subsequently arrested on suspicion of murder.
A woman who lives near the station said that she heard a woman screaming as if in distress at about 10.30pm on Thursday.
Detective Inspector Dick Turner praised the public spiritedness of the Tube maintenance workers.
I think we have seen this article somewhere else:
A woman was found dead after two Tube maintenance workers wrestled a man to the ground in the car park of Finchley Central Underground station. The workers thought that the man was drunk and about to drive away but on arrival the police found a blood-stained knife and blood on his clothing. After questioning the man, police forced entry to a house and the body of a woman in her fifties was found.
The Metropolitan Police said that the London Ambulance Service pronounced the woman dead at about 3.10am yesterday. She has not yet been formally identified.The man, who is in his twenties, was subsequently arrested on suspicion of murder.
A woman who lives near the station said that she heard a woman screaming as if in distress at about 10.30pm on Thursday.
Detective Inspector Dick Turner praised the public spiritedness of the Tube maintenance workers.
Posted by: Filibuster, . on 10:29am Sat 10 May 08
'The British wanted us to kill each other'
Said Jabr, 74, Arab Israeli
The old British Army base, a small sandstone fort, stands abandoned on a hill in Abu Ghosh, an Arab village just southwest of Jerusalem. Said Jabr was 14 when the British pulled out.
“It was on the 14th or 15th of May. I remember exactly that the British commander came to Ali Saleh, the village mukhtar (elder), and said they were going to leave and warned us to be ready,” he recalled from his family home in Abu Ghosh. “Thirty-five armed villagers walked into the base to take command. But the British commander went at the same time to the kibbutz and told them the same thing.
“The British left one tank in front of the army base. Then a few tanks driven by the Haganah (the fledgling Jewish army) drove up and surrounded the army base. But we had great relations with the local kibbutzim – we believe in friendship and protecting a neighbour’s property, no matter who they are – and the leaders of the kibbutzim. . . came to the village. They met the mukhtar, drank coffee and reached an agreement that the villagers would leave the base and the Haganah would take over. The British commander was waiting in the remaining tank to see what would happen. He saw the Abu Ghosh villagers leaving the base and shaking hands with the Haganah members, and he said, ‘F****** Arabs’. Our impression was that he wanted us to kill each other. Thank God the people from both sides resolved the issue peacefully.”
Mr Jabr proudly displays the Hebrew shield he was awarded by the kibbutz. It shows two hands shaking – a token of thanks and friendship.
'The British wanted us to kill each other'
Said Jabr, 74, Arab Israeli
The old British Army base, a small sandstone fort, stands abandoned on a hill in Abu Ghosh, an Arab village just southwest of Jerusalem. Said Jabr was 14 when the British pulled out.
“It was on the 14th or 15th of May. I remember exactly that the British commander came to Ali Saleh, the village mukhtar (elder), and said they were going to leave and warned us to be ready,” he recalled from his family home in Abu Ghosh. “Thirty-five armed villagers walked into the base to take command. But the British commander went at the same time to the kibbutz and told them the same thing.
“The British left one tank in front of the army base. Then a few tanks driven by the Haganah (the fledgling Jewish army) drove up and surrounded the army base. But we had great relations with the local kibbutzim – we believe in friendship and protecting a neighbour’s property, no matter who they are – and the leaders of the kibbutzim. . . came to the village. They met the mukhtar, drank coffee and reached an agreement that the villagers would leave the base and the Haganah would take over. The British commander was waiting in the remaining tank to see what would happen. He saw the Abu Ghosh villagers leaving the base and shaking hands with the Haganah members, and he said, ‘F****** Arabs’. Our impression was that he wanted us to kill each other. Thank God the people from both sides resolved the issue peacefully.”
Mr Jabr proudly displays the Hebrew shield he was awarded by the kibbutz. It shows two hands shaking – a token of thanks and friendship.
Posted by: We value Deomcracy, Even if Rog T does not on 11:00am Sat 10 May 08
World: South Asia
Pro-democracy demo in Bhutan
The police in Bhutan say they have broken up a pro-democracy demonstration in the kingdom's southern town of Phuentsoling.
A spokesman for the pro-democracy groups said a number of demonstrators had been severely beaten up by police and nearly fifty people had been arrested.
There is no word on arrests from the police.
Bhutan has recently introduced political reforms to ensure what it describes as a more participatory form of government.
Pro-democracy groups says these changes are largely cosmetic.
They are calling for a parliamentary form of government with a constitutional monarchy
World: South Asia
Pro-democracy demo in Bhutan
The police in Bhutan say they have broken up a pro-democracy demonstration in the kingdom's southern town of Phuentsoling.
A spokesman for the pro-democracy groups said a number of demonstrators had been severely beaten up by police and nearly fifty people had been arrested.
There is no word on arrests from the police.
Bhutan has recently introduced political reforms to ensure what it describes as a more participatory form of government.
Pro-democracy groups says these changes are largely cosmetic.
They are calling for a parliamentary form of government with a constitutional monarchy
Posted by: Roger Tailor, Totteridge on 11:02am Sat 10 May 08
Good to see Daniel being bitter again !
So the Ballot papers were twenty minutes late, Well Bo Ho: it's not ideal, it's not good, it should have been handled better; now get over it. If Leo Boland can't do better next time, then sack the useless g**.
If just one voter has been denied his right to vote, well that's life get over it.
Good to see Daniel being bitter again !
So the Ballot papers were twenty minutes late, Well Bo Ho: it's not ideal, it's not good, it should have been handled better; now get over it. If Leo Boland can't do better next time, then sack the useless g**.
If just one voter has been denied his right to vote, well that's life get over it.
Posted by: Dis, Proportionate on 11:04am Sat 10 May 08
If one person was deined their vote the the Returning Officer should be put in prision.
If one person was deined their vote the the Returning Officer should be put in prision.
Posted by: Phili Buster, Mill Hill on 11:05am Sat 10 May 08
Bob Pearson, who was conducting an exit poll, said voters reported papers running out on one side of the polling station. He said voters were told the remaining papers could not be divided out because they were already registered to an address.
He added: "I spoke to various people going in and they were furious to lose their democratic right.
Bob Pearson, who was conducting an exit poll, said voters reported papers running out on one side of the polling station. He said voters were told the remaining papers could not be divided out because they were already registered to an address.
He added: "I spoke to various people going in and they were furious to lose their democratic right.
Posted by: Reality, Bites on 12:45pm Sat 10 May 08
Democracy is really important and we must make great efforts to promote it's practise.
I do know that there are some people out there who will criticise me for supporting democracy.
But we must also remember the human eliment and retain a sense of proportion. Yes there were mistakes in Mill Hill, but in the other twenty barnet wards there were no mistakes. In Camden there were no mistakes. So lets remember that the returning officer got it mostly right.
I do know that this will not be acceptable to Rog T. So sorry, too bad.
Democracy is really important and we must make great efforts to promote it's practise.
I do know that there are some people out there who will criticise me for supporting democracy.
But we must also remember the human eliment and retain a sense of proportion. Yes there were mistakes in Mill Hill, but in the other twenty barnet wards there were no mistakes. In Camden there were no mistakes. So lets remember that the returning officer got it mostly right.
I do know that this will not be acceptable to Rog T. So sorry, too bad.
Posted by: Rog T, Mill Hill on 4:01pm Sat 10 May 08
"Reality Bites" you are quite right. I do find it unacceptable. I run a business and attention to detail is the difference between success and failure. I have no idea why you seem to find such poor performance from Barnet Council acceptable.
Tell me, are you part of this campaign to post nonsense under the name of Phili Buster et all of is it just an unfortunate coincidence?
If Barnet Council had performed perfectly and this was the only time they had shown themselves unable to organise anything, maybe you'd have a point but it seems to happen all the time. What about the meals on wheels fiasco? The chopped down trees in a nature reserve without proper surveys being performed to name but two. The former Mayorerected an extension without planning permission whilst head of the Hendon Planning committee. This is a council which took 3 years to process a rates appeal for my business which returned thousands of pounds of my money to me. This is a council which has done nothing about illegal turns onto Mill Hill Broadway, despite doing a survey a year ago which found this happened 300 times per day. This is a council which has 6,000 families waiting for accomodation, whilst allowing private developers free reign over West Hendon. This the council which says it cares about the environment, but wants to put a dual carriageway across Montrose Park.
I am sorry if you don't like these facts, but the council are incompetant. We see it every day. It is badly lead and inefficient. If you want to explain all of these instances of incompetance then fine, fire away.
I expect all I'll get is another 20 posts from you and your mates in an attempt to hide the truth.
"Reality Bites" you are quite right. I do find it unacceptable. I run a business and attention to detail is the difference between success and failure. I have no idea why you seem to find such poor performance from Barnet Council acceptable.
Tell me, are you part of this campaign to post nonsense under the name of Phili Buster et all of is it just an unfortunate coincidence?
If Barnet Council had performed perfectly and this was the only time they had shown themselves unable to organise anything, maybe you'd have a point but it seems to happen all the time. What about the meals on wheels fiasco? The chopped down trees in a nature reserve without proper surveys being performed to name but two. The former Mayorerected an extension without planning permission whilst head of the Hendon Planning committee. This is a council which took 3 years to process a rates appeal for my business which returned thousands of pounds of my money to me. This is a council which has done nothing about illegal turns onto Mill Hill Broadway, despite doing a survey a year ago which found this happened 300 times per day. This is a council which has 6,000 families waiting for accomodation, whilst allowing private developers free reign over West Hendon. This the council which says it cares about the environment, but wants to put a dual carriageway across Montrose Park.
I am sorry if you don't like these facts, but the council are incompetant. We see it every day. It is badly lead and inefficient. If you want to explain all of these instances of incompetance then fine, fire away.
I expect all I'll get is another 20 posts from you and your mates in an attempt to hide the truth.
Posted by: Rog T, Mill Hill on 4:01pm Sat 10 May 08
"Reality Bites" you are quite right. I do find it unacceptable. I run a business and attention to detail is the difference between success and failure. I have no idea why you seem to find such poor performance from Barnet Council acceptable.
Tell me, are you part of this campaign to post nonsense under the name of Phili Buster et all of is it just an unfortunate coincidence?
If Barnet Council had performed perfectly and this was the only time they had shown themselves unable to organise anything, maybe you'd have a point but it seems to happen all the time. What about the meals on wheels fiasco? The chopped down trees in a nature reserve without proper surveys being performed to name but two. The former Mayorerected an extension without planning permission whilst head of the Hendon Planning committee. This is a council which took 3 years to process a rates appeal for my business which returned thousands of pounds of my money to me. This is a council which has done nothing about illegal turns onto Mill Hill Broadway, despite doing a survey a year ago which found this happened 300 times per day. This is a council which has 6,000 families waiting for accomodation, whilst allowing private developers free reign over West Hendon. This the council which says it cares about the environment, but wants to put a dual carriageway across Montrose Park.
I am sorry if you don't like these facts, but the council are incompetant. We see it every day. It is badly lead and inefficient. If you want to explain all of these instances of incompetance then fine, fire away.
I expect all I'll get is another 20 posts from you and your mates in an attempt to hide the truth.
"Reality Bites" you are quite right. I do find it unacceptable. I run a business and attention to detail is the difference between success and failure. I have no idea why you seem to find such poor performance from Barnet Council acceptable.
Tell me, are you part of this campaign to post nonsense under the name of Phili Buster et all of is it just an unfortunate coincidence?
If Barnet Council had performed perfectly and this was the only time they had shown themselves unable to organise anything, maybe you'd have a point but it seems to happen all the time. What about the meals on wheels fiasco? The chopped down trees in a nature reserve without proper surveys being performed to name but two. The former Mayorerected an extension without planning permission whilst head of the Hendon Planning committee. This is a council which took 3 years to process a rates appeal for my business which returned thousands of pounds of my money to me. This is a council which has done nothing about illegal turns onto Mill Hill Broadway, despite doing a survey a year ago which found this happened 300 times per day. This is a council which has 6,000 families waiting for accomodation, whilst allowing private developers free reign over West Hendon. This the council which says it cares about the environment, but wants to put a dual carriageway across Montrose Park.
I am sorry if you don't like these facts, but the council are incompetant. We see it every day. It is badly lead and inefficient. If you want to explain all of these instances of incompetance then fine, fire away.
I expect all I'll get is another 20 posts from you and your mates in an attempt to hide the truth.
Posted by: Reality, Bites on 6:39pm Sat 10 May 08
I didn't think we'd see eye to eye over this one...
I didn't think we'd see eye to eye over this one...
Posted by: Rog T, Mill Hill on 11:10am Sun 11 May 08
As usual, no answers from the voice of reason
As usual, no answers from the voice of reason
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